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Ego
Dec 3, 2011 2:37:17 GMT
Post by withinsilence on Dec 3, 2011 2:37:17 GMT
The world is the same; it has always been the same — upside down, crazy, insane. In fact, only one thing new has happened in the world, and that is the awareness that we are crazy, that we are upside down, that something is basically wrong with us. And this is a great blessing — this awareness. Osho Now, ask why....why is the world insane, what is its causation, what is yours? Where do all outside words and actions originate?
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Ego
Dec 3, 2011 5:37:14 GMT
Post by tathagata on Dec 3, 2011 5:37:14 GMT
;D Yeah, and 'normal' is easy enough to define as a word, but not at all easy to define as a concept. Matter of fact, if the folks I interact with every day are 'normal' (questionable in itself), I am not normal. Not the average guy, not the 'mean' individual... hey, there are a lot of conceptual people out there who don't actually exist. Hmm, I wonder where within can take that notion. This is why Buddha refused to get involved in metaphysical discussions as all speculation leads to suffering. I will accept and try to practice his advice. This is what I "try" to do but fail miserably at on the other forum, as much as I try to stick to mentioning a method for someone to find their own answers it's tough to not get drawn into a metaphysical debate lol Any technique offered is criticized tooth and nail so the esoteric philosophy debate can keep winding along lol
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Ego
Dec 3, 2011 6:57:21 GMT
Post by gurthbruins on Dec 3, 2011 6:57:21 GMT
Having said all that, my thoughts turn to this: do we need such a long story? As FreeThinker says, I too don't have much time for long, confusing if not confused arguments. So I ask, is one word enough to tell the whole story, or isn't it? (I am holding my own opinion back here.) Is 'ego' a useful word in such a scheme? I put forward as candidate a word that has already gained a lot of support as the prime key to everything: acceptance. Is that word enough? If not, what extra words need to be added? not sentences; let's try to be brief for a moment, to limit ourselves to the really essential. I refuse to accept 'acceptance' as the final word. IMO life is a struggle. Occasionally a battle, but always a struggle. Even if things are going well in the external world (one doesn't have to extend one's vision very far to see that they are not), things in my internal world could always be better. To accept things as they are is the internal equivalent of self-satisfaction. Self satisfaction is a null-state equivalent to non-existence. I could go on for awhile, but I have probably lost my 'readership' already. No way you've lost readership already, it's just starting. But apply 'acceptance' correctly. You refuse to accept the word: accept your refusal, and we all must do so. You feel life is a struggle, and so do I. Accept the struggle, and go on struggling! Accept the fact that things are as they are. Nobody is saying they must continue so into the future! If you want to change things, accept your wanting to change them and change them! Accepting does not mean feeling self-satisfied.
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Ego
Dec 3, 2011 7:30:26 GMT
Post by gurthbruins on Dec 3, 2011 7:30:26 GMT
Posted by popee on Today at 1:09am:
True, but also there is a comradeship in sharing shit and speculations. Good place to insert my favourite quotation:
# my favourite quotation is : (Confucius) "Life leads the thoughtful man on a path of many windings. Now the course is checked, now it runs straight again. Here winged thoughts may pour freely forth in words, There the heavy burden of knowledge must be shut away in silence. But when two people are at one in their inmost hearts, They shatter even the strength of iron or of bronze. And when two people understand each other in their inmost hearts, Their words are sweet and strong, like the fragrance of orchids." #
Posted by withinsilence on Today at 2:15am:
Leela is a valuable concept: life as a game. If we partake in metaphysical discussions as a game, we can learn sportsmanship, not too take things to heart too much, maintain your sense of humour, and so on. A little suffering won't hurt us, it's all in the game. As long as you play fair and clean, and have a bit of fun in the process.
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Ego
Dec 3, 2011 10:46:50 GMT
Post by tathagata on Dec 3, 2011 10:46:50 GMT
Posted by popee on Today at 1:09am: True, but also there is a comradeship in sharing shit and speculations. Good place to insert my favourite quotation: # my favourite quotation is : (Confucius) "Life leads the thoughtful man on a path of many windings. Now the course is checked, now it runs straight again. Here winged thoughts may pour freely forth in words, There the heavy burden of knowledge must be shut away in silence. But when two people are at one in their inmost hearts, They shatter even the strength of iron or of bronze. And when two people understand each other in their inmost hearts, Their words are sweet and strong, like the fragrance of orchids." # Posted by withinsilence on Today at 2:15am: Leela is a valuable concept: life as a game. If we partake in metaphysical discussions as a game, we can learn sportsmanship, not too take things to heart too much, maintain your sense of humour, and so on. A little suffering won't hurt us, it's all in the game. As long as you play fair and clean, and have a bit of fun in the process. Lol...yeah I took that approach over there, but things started to lean toward personal attacks on my character, this doesn't bother me, but it's also not productive lol
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Ego
Dec 3, 2011 11:11:32 GMT
Post by gurthbruins on Dec 3, 2011 11:11:32 GMT
Yes, that approach doesn't always work, sometimes the best thing we can do is just to walk away. Some places are too full of shit, why suffer the stink?
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Ego
Dec 3, 2011 12:49:55 GMT
Post by withinsilence on Dec 3, 2011 12:49:55 GMT
Posted by popee on Today at 1:09am: True, but also there is a comradeship in sharing shit and speculations. Good place to insert my favourite quotation: # my favourite quotation is : (Confucius) "Life leads the thoughtful man on a path of many windings. Now the course is checked, now it runs straight again. Here winged thoughts may pour freely forth in words, There the heavy burden of knowledge must be shut away in silence. But when two people are at one in their inmost hearts, They shatter even the strength of iron or of bronze. And when two people understand each other in their inmost hearts, Their words are sweet and strong, like the fragrance of orchids." # Posted by withinsilence on Today at 2:15am: Leela is a valuable concept: life as a game. If we partake in metaphysical discussions as a game, we can learn sportsmanship, not too take things to heart too much, maintain your sense of humour, and so on. A little suffering won't hurt us, it's all in the game. As long as you play fair and clean, and have a bit of fun in the process. Lol...yeah I took that approach over there, but things started to lean toward personal attacks on my character, this doesn't bother me, but it's also not productive lol A Metaphor For Practicing "Skillful Means"You can’t give water to those who are not thirsty You can’t grow beautiful flowers by planting thistle You make nothing grow by planting it! Over watering causes the plants to drown Too much light causes the plants to dry up Let the plants be free after you plant the seeds They really don’t need you to control them All any plant wants is a little water And a little light each and every day For in their own time the seeds you planted Will become all that they’re intended to be Just love them as they are and let them grow and die naturally Are we humans that different from nature? WS
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Ego
Dec 3, 2011 13:31:08 GMT
Post by withinsilence on Dec 3, 2011 13:31:08 GMT
I refuse to accept 'acceptance' as the final word. IMO life is a struggle. Occasionally a battle, but always a struggle. Even if things are going well in the external world (one doesn't have to extend one's vision very far to see that they are not), things in my internal world could always be better. To accept things as they are is the internal equivalent of self-satisfaction. Self satisfaction is a null-state equivalent to non-existence. I could go on for awhile, but I have probably lost my 'readership' already. No way you've lost readership already, it's just starting. But apply 'acceptance' correctly. You refuse to accept the word: accept your refusal, and we all must do so. You feel life is a struggle, and so do I. Accept the struggle, and go on struggling! Accept the fact that things are as they are. Nobody is saying they must continue so into the future! If you want to change things, accept your wanting to change them and change them! Accepting does not mean feeling self-satisfied. Osho - Acceptance is one of the most beautiful words. Buddhists, the followers of Buddha, have a term for it which is even deeper than the English word ‘acceptance’; it is tathata. tathata means saying ‘yes’ so totally that in your being there is no division. You become one in your yes. You say ‘yes’ so totally that there exists no ‘no’ inside you, no denial. There is an inner politics. Acceptance, total acceptance, tathata, means without any political decision — total. There is nobody who says ‘no’ within you, not even a fragment, because even a fragment can be destructive. And even if part of you says ‘no’ you cannot receive the true teaching. You would like to receive the true teaching without any change. You would like to receive the true teaching as you are. That is not possible. It is not possible because of the very nature of the true teaching. I cannot do anything about it, nobody can. It is in the nature of the very phenomenon; you receive it only when you accept it. God is available, Truth is available, Light is available, but you are such a miser in receiving. You are not only a miser in giving, you are a miser in receiving also. A miser has to be a miser whatsoever he does. You cannot give; you cannot receive. What type of life have you got? Giving and receiving are two aspects of the same coin. If you can give, you can also receive. Hence, so much insistence on giving — giving to people whatsoever you can give — giving in love. There is so much insistence from all the religions to give; give more and more. Why? — so that you can become capable of receiving more and more. Remember, it is just like inhalation and exhalation. If you exhale deeply, automatically you will inhale deeply. If you want to inhale deeply, you will have to exhale deeply — there is no other way. And life is a balance between exhalation and inhalation. If you are afraid of exhalation your breathing will become shallow. Then your inhalation cannot be very deep. it is impossible. Exhalation is giving, giving whatsoever you can give. And the more you give, the more you become capable of receiving. And when you give completely, utterly, totally, that is the moment of acceptance. Now this guy knows his shit!
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Ego
Dec 3, 2011 14:43:14 GMT
Post by freethinker on Dec 3, 2011 14:43:14 GMT
I refuse to accept 'acceptance' as the final word. IMO life is a struggle. Occasionally a battle, but always a struggle. Even if things are going well in the external world (one doesn't have to extend one's vision very far to see that they are not), things in my internal world could always be better. To accept things as they are is the internal equivalent of self-satisfaction. Self satisfaction is a null-state equivalent to non-existence. I could go on for awhile, but I have probably lost my 'readership' already. No way you've lost readership already, it's just starting. But apply 'acceptance' correctly. You refuse to accept the word: accept your refusal, and we all must do so. You feel life is a struggle, and so do I. Accept the struggle, and go on struggling! Accept the fact that things are as they are. Nobody is saying they must continue so into the future! If you want to change things, accept your wanting to change them and change them! Accepting does not mean feeling self-satisfied. Sorry Gurth, what you are referring to isn't 'acceptance', it's 'acknowledgment'. Acceptance in the context we are in is a form of surrender. There may come a time when I surrender, but it hasn't arrived yet. I can acknowledge life's 'slings and arrows' without compromising my defenses - at least for awhile. When I have used up all will-to-resist, it will be time to go to God, there being nothing remaining for me here. [There is something about this forum. The above paragraph, besides stating my sentiment, reads just about as trite and cliched as anything I have read. Tsk tsk.]
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Ego
Dec 3, 2011 14:58:47 GMT
Post by gurthbruins on Dec 3, 2011 14:58:47 GMT
Trite and cliched is fine, the clarity is finer: I take to such plain speaking. I feel I understand what you are saying, which is not always the case with some writings.
A man must do what a man must do: I have no judgements to offer, I am only interested in the facts in the case of FreeThinker. So thanks for stating your sentiment.
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Ego
Dec 3, 2011 15:08:21 GMT
Post by withinsilence on Dec 3, 2011 15:08:21 GMT
No way you've lost readership already, it's just starting. But apply 'acceptance' correctly. You refuse to accept the word: accept your refusal, and we all must do so. You feel life is a struggle, and so do I. Accept the struggle, and go on struggling! Accept the fact that things are as they are. Nobody is saying they must continue so into the future! If you want to change things, accept your wanting to change them and change them! Accepting does not mean feeling self-satisfied. Sorry Gurth, what you are referring to isn't 'acceptance', it's 'acknowledgment'. Acceptance in the context we are in is a form of surrender. There may come a time when I surrender, but it hasn't arrived yet. I can acknowledge life's 'slings and arrows' without compromising my defenses - at least for awhile. When I have used up all will-to-resist, it will be time to go to God, there being nothing remaining for me here. [There is something about this forum. The above paragraph, besides stating my sentiment, reads just about as trite and cliched as anything I have read. Tsk tsk.] You are already with God but your non-acceptance, non-surrender and your lack of acknowledgment are keeping you from living in him. But as everything in life it is solely your choice as nobody can do it for you. You can try to help a horse find water but....you know the rest.
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Ego
Dec 3, 2011 15:12:04 GMT
Post by withinsilence on Dec 3, 2011 15:12:04 GMT
It saddens me so That most will never know The truth that sets you free Is hidden in plain sight to see The perfect place to hide The truth deep inside That which is seeking Inside it should be peeking
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Ego
Dec 3, 2011 15:21:12 GMT
Post by gurthbruins on Dec 3, 2011 15:21:12 GMT
Diamonds are held in safes And what may be even in waifs If precious and clear as air Is deeply hidden there And doth not fly at random on the air.
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Ego
Dec 3, 2011 16:12:03 GMT
Post by freethinker on Dec 3, 2011 16:12:03 GMT
[...] You are already with God but your non-acceptance, non-surrender and your lack of acknowledgment are keeping you from living in him. But as everything in life it is solely your choice as nobody can do it for you. You can try to help a horse find water but....you know the rest. We certainly have different[glow=red,2,300] 'understandings of the situation'.[/glow] My understanding is that my time on Earth is my time, to do what I can to live an honorable life and to do what I can as a humanist to help others help themselves. "It ain't easy, but someone's gotta do it." Actually, I don't stress myself out, I eat too much and drink too much, and fail to do what I should be doing on many occasions. Having regrets doesn't fix the failures, but they do seem to cut down on repetition; maybe before senility closes the door, my rights will outpace my wrongs.
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Ego
Dec 3, 2011 16:57:34 GMT
Post by withinsilence on Dec 3, 2011 16:57:34 GMT
[...] You are already with God but your non-acceptance, non-surrender and your lack of acknowledgment are keeping you from living in him. But as everything in life it is solely your choice as nobody can do it for you. You can try to help a horse find water but....you know the rest. We certainly have different[glow=red,2,300] 'understandings of the situation'.[/glow] My understanding is that my time on Earth is my time, to do what I can to live an honorable life and to do what I can as a humanist to help others help themselves. "It ain't easy, but someone's gotta do it." Actually, I don't stress myself out, I eat too much and drink too much, and fail to do what I should be doing on many occasions. Having regrets doesn't fix the failures, but they do seem to cut down on repetition; maybe before senility closes the door, my rights will outpace my wrongs. It is your time my friend, but that which you believe your going back to has never left. This belief in separation is the result of one single ignorant thought of the mind.....me not we. ACCEPTANCE IS: Awareness Consciousness Contentedness Patients Thoughtfulness Allowing Nurturing Constancy Equanimity and the result is PEACE Practicing Eternally Acceptance Continuously Evolving
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